Reply-To: "DarrenH" <darrenh@overtime.ca>
From: "DarrenH" <darrenh@overtime.ca>
Newsgroups: rec.arts.int-fiction
References: <a9hvs6$riq$1@wiscnews.wiscnet.net> <6r0v8.16852$f5.1136486@news>
Subject: Re: UNIX as literature; or, why IF and GUIs don't mix
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Clarification:  When I say "drag and drop" I'm referring in general to GUIs,
not any interface in particular.



"DarrenH" <darrenh@overtime.ca> wrote in message
news:6r0v8.16852$f5.1136486@news...
> I belive (as a programmer myself) that it's pretty hard to code something
of
> any versatility without "getting under the hood" and doing the work of
> line-by-line programming.  It's nice to work in an 'environment' when
> possible, I find that Visual Basic is particularly nice in this respect as
> you can catch and fix various obvious syntactic bugs as you write.
> Fortunately (or unfortunately, if you don't like programming), you still
> need to do the coding other than while creating the visible forms that the
> program runs behind.
>
> A drag-and-drop style of programming environment will, through limiting
the
> input of the programmer, limit the control the programmer has over the
final
> product.  This doesn't mean the work will be inherently worse than a
> hand-coded piece, sometimes it might be the best solution depending on the
> story.  It's just that it may resemble other drag-and-drop works of IF
> you've encountered, with the same set of strengths and weaknesses based on
> the engine used to create the work.
>
> A slightly OT analogy (but comparable):  I as a new media worker can
almost
> always tell when someone has coded their website by hand or by using
> programs like Front Page.  And any doubt can be removed by viewing the
> source HTML, the quality of which may not be important to the browser when
> rendering a page but can sure cause problems if a coder decides to go back
> and modify an existing work later on.
>
> Good, clean coding is still an important thing to be able to do and good
> coding habits are important.  And the act of coding, for me, is
challenging,
> fun, and it keeps my mind sharp.  And I need all the help I can get.....
:)
>
> Cheers
> Darren
>
>
>
> "Dennis G. Jerz" <JerzDG@uwec.edu> wrote in message
> news:a9hvs6$riq$1@wiscnews.wiscnet.net...
> > I use IF-IDE for small Inform projects, and I use it when I introduce
> Inform
> > to my students -- but I find that I don't use it for my major works, for
> > various reasons.  One of those reasons is that I started my current WIP
> long
> > before I had heard of IF-IDE, and had developed macros for my text
editor
> of
> > choice -- and that has nothing to do with the quality of IF-IDE, and
> > everything to do with my own unwillingness to change.
> >
> > I hope IF-IDE continues to develop -- it does more than show great
> promise,
> > it really does help flatten the learning curve.
> >
> > But I recently came across an interesting article that argues that UNIX
> > appeals to the most intellectual of comptuer programmers in part because
> the
> > command-line style of programming more closely resembles the act of
> writing
> > an essay.
> >
> > "Working on the command line, hands poised over the keys uninterrupted
by
> > frequent reaches for the mouse, is a posture familiar to wordsmiths
> > (especially the really old guys who once worked on teletypes or electric
> > typewriters). It makes some of the same demands as writing an essay.
Both
> > require composition skills. Both demand a thorough knowledge of grammar
> and
> > syntax. Both reward mastery with powerful, compact expression." --
Thomas
> > Scoville
> > http://web.meganet.net/yeti/PCarticle.html
> >
> > Does what Scoville say about UNIX apply to IF programming?  Do the
people
> > who NEED a GUI interface really have what it takes to produce quality
IF?
> > Or is that an elitist assumption?
> >
> >
> > --
> > Dennis G. Jerz, Ph.D.; (715)836-2431
> > Dept. of English; U Wisc.-Eau Claire
> > 419 Hibbard,  Eau Claire, WI   54702
> > ------------------------------------
> > Literacy Weblog: www.uwec.edu/jerzdg
> >
> >
>
>


